Brian Bristow and Alfred McDonald Transcription

[Transcript of Brian Bristow and Alfred McDonald interviewed by Sam Waller Museum staff, edited for clarity]

[Sharain Jones testing microphone]

SJ:           This is Sharain Jones, and this evening I’ll be interviewing Brian Bristow, and Alfred McDonald of the Elks. It is Wednesday, July the 15^th, and we’re meeting at about 7:00, here at the Sam Waller Museum, in the Rotary room. So I’ll get Brian to introduce himself.

BB:         I’m Brian Bristow. I’m the exalted ruler of the Elks.

SJ:           Okay, now Alfred.

AM:       I’m Alfred McDonald. I’m the secretary of the Elks.

SJ:           Okay. Now, since I let you both review the questions, I don’t know if there’s anything I shouldn’t ask, but the first one here is: “if I knew nothing about your organization, how would you explain it to me?”

[Brian mutters]

SJ:           Okay, Brian’s brought something for us to review. Looks like a calendar cover, and it actually has the history of the Elks of Canada, which was founded on September 26^th 1912, and incorporated under a special dominion of Canada charter. So the first lodge was established in Vancouver, and officers and members expanded the Elks organization across Canada.

[Someone whispering]

SJ:           So, from what I understand, the Elks is a service organization, so they do a lot of volunteer activities to improve communities, is that correct?

BB:         Community service and also children’s needs sort of thing.

SJ:           So how does it pertain to children’s needs?

BB:         Hearing, speech and hearing problems, for one, and then, we do other stuff too for the children, like we’ve given iPads and stuff to the school here, for some of their students that are-

AM:       Can’t afford it

BB:         Can’t afford it, or can’t comprehend being told, but they can understand reading it.

AM:       It helps special needs.

BB:         There used to be a hearing-whatever you call it-machine for testing hearing and that, in the provincial building at one time, and that was sponsored by the Elks. Not only locally, but-

SJ:           For the region?

BB:         Canadian wide, yeah, the Canadian Elks helped sponsor too, but…

AM:       And we also support information on alcohol and drug abuse. And some lodges, you know, have artistic competitions, where people paint-

BB:         Poster contests.

AM:       Poster contests, yeah. It’s run through the schools. And so, the Elks provides prizes and scholarships and that.

SJ:           Now, this work that you’re talking about with the hearing testing can be, drug and alcohol awareness. Has that been something you’ve done historically, or is that more into modern times, or contemporary times?

BB:         It’s more… I don’t know how many years ago they quit doing it here.

AM:       Because we kind of worked closely with schools, and so, you know, if the teachers from the schools were interested, you know, they’ve been taking this on, in their jobs, and working with us, but if they were too busy, we could do nothing. But, we also fund that spray park, we’re trying to get it going, anything to help children. But we don’t go and spread it around, we just kind of do everything under the table. And also, if parents have children who require special needs, they can apply to the Elks for special help.

BB:         And the money from that usually comes from Grand Lodge, itself, like for special needs, for some of the special needs stuff.

SJ:           Alright, now what prompted you to join the Elks of Canada? Like, at that time, there’s so many other service groups to join, why the Elks?

BB:         I joined, because of the people I was curling with, at the time, belonged to the Elks. In the same age group and that, so I started to get drawn in.

AM:       I joined, because some of the people I worked with, like Don [last name], he was active in the Elks. Back then, I was involved in Air Cadets, and actually the Air Cadet’s squadron in The Pas was started, or funded by the Elks. So the proper name is 303 The Pas Elks. Yeah, like usually what they do is they don’t say Elks, because you see the Legion, Elks, Rotary, in terms of donations-

BB:         Financial assistance.

AM:       Financial assistance. So that was kind of my connection to get in there, and it’s been good.

SJ:           Now, in your opinion, what are the ups and downs of being a member?

BB:         I really don’t know. [Laughs] I guess the upside is, friends and whatnot that you meet through the Elks and that. The downside, I don’t know.

AM:       I guess the downside is, is that there’s not as many members as there used to be, because people are busy-

BB:         Yeah, that’s the downside right now.

AM:       And the upside was the social kind of part of it, and being a community service club. That’s a good feeling, knowing you can help the community.

SJ:           Now, how long have you been a member of the Elks?

BB:         I believe thirty-five years.

SJ:           And you’re thinking? [referring to AM]

AM:       I was thinking probably twenty-five, I thought I might have joined around 1990, or ’88.

BB:         I could’ve brought those records, I guess, if I’d thought about it, but it’s somewhere around there for us.

SJ:           Could you talk about some of the projects or programs you’ve participated in? I realize you’ve mentioned that with the hearing clinic, and then with your poster contest for the prevention of drugs and alcohol.

AM:       And the Air Cadets.

BB:         The Air Cadets squadron is one of our main things. There’s a list other things, helped the Rotary Club to upgrade the sound system in the arena, Rotary Club had benches that remained for the rodeo grounds, we helped them with that. The flagpole at the bridge there, we paid some of the expenses for that. And the monument along the walking path there, that overlooks the river, by the boat dock, that is there.

SJ:           Now, what did it entail in setting up the local cadet squadron?  ‘Cause I always thought it was here, but I had no idea a service group was involved in getting it organized.

BB:         I have no idea. This has been going on for many years. I think some of our older members, Tom Mack, and Gordon Turner, Gordon Turner was the commander of the Air Cadet squadron for many years. Before, and then Murray Harvey, then Doug Long just stepped down as commanding officer, and passed it over.

AM:       And Barry Kreller, he was-

BB:         Barry Kreller was involved in that too, yeah.

AM:       He owned A&W years ago, but he and his wife, you know.

BB:         It doesn’t say anything in the book here about Air Cadets.

AM:       And the nice thing about the Air Cadets is that it doesn’t cost anybody anything to join. Like, everything is free, all the summer camps and things.

BB:         It’s all funded by us sponsoring bodies, or by, actually, the military supplies them with a lot of sleeping bags and stuff like that, when they do a camp-out thing.

SJ:           Okay, now what have you learned from being a member, or having been a member? I understand you’re both current members of the Elks?

BB:         I don’t know… [laughing]

AM:       Well, I was thinking back, like, certainly how to run meetings, initiate projects, and annually, people had the time, there’s usually a conference once a year, at different locations.

BB:         There’s a provincial conference, and then there’s a Canadian conference every year, that we can attend. I’ve never attended any of them. Some of our members have.

SJ:           Did they find it was worthwhile, going?

BB:         Oh yeah. You get your concerns heard, of what concerns you may have from our community, sort of thing, or from your district. Our district here was made up of Flin Flon, Snow Lake, Thompson, and The Pas. So there was the four lodges.

AM:       And we would have an annual meeting, and it would kind of rotate. Thompson, or Flin Flon, or Snow Lake, and actually, one of the strongest lodges was Snow Lake.

SJ:           Now, do you still have your annual meetings with the four cities?

BB:         No. Just about all of the Elks have given up on having annual spring meetings now. They try and get one person elected from each lodge to maybe get together with a member from one of the other lodges and stuff, and whatever sort of make up a little letter of whatever, and send it to Grand Lodge for what they’d like to see done.

SJ:           So why do you think this has happened, that meetings are no longer-

BB:         Travel. That was the big thing here, was travel. We ended up starting always going to Snow Lake, which is still two and a half hours, well, it was two and a half hours for everybody to get there, more or less.

AM:       And usually these meetings were on weekends too, because everybody was working. And, you know, to take a day off to go to these other locations…

SJ:           Now, is there a general reaction that someone has after learning you are a member of the Elks?

BB:         No, I don’t think so. It’s the same as finding out that someone is a member of the Kinsmen, or the Lions, or whatever. It’s nothing, out of the ordinary, I don’t think.

AM:       I guess, you know, almost the service clubs are losing members. So they‘re always asking, “You know, why don’t you, you know, you can still be a member of the Elks and join us”, because the numbers are getting lower, and at one time, the Kinsmen was really growing, but now, you know, they’re getting less in numbers too.

BB:         Less and less. For example, when I joined, there was a hundred and twenty-five, twenty-six or so members of the Elks in The Pas?

SJ:           In The Pas? Oh my goodness. That’s lots.

BB:         That’s thirty-some odd years ago, or whatever. And today-

SJ:           You have how many members?

BB:         Six. And six life members. So there’s twelve of us all together. The life members, I think there’s only about one that lives in town. The rest are, most of them live in BC now, or somewhere sunny and warm.

SJ:           Now with this decline, what do you think that could be? Alfred and I were talking a little bit about it before you came, right now there are so many other opportunities for people to entertain themselves outside of work.

BB:         A lot of the problem here with members was that, to get younger members in, a lot of them worked at the, either for the railroad, or for the [what sounds like repap] back then. And they worked shift work. And then they got married, and then there’s a little baby, and, well, you come home at eight o’clock at night, you’re not running away to a meeting when you should be staying home with the children, or whatever, sort of thing.

AM:       Like twelve hour shifts, eight to eight.

SJ:           Yeah, ‘cause it’s four on, and four off.

BB:         Whether your day off hit the thing. I know, they find it the same, like, I belong to the curling club, and we find it the same there for curling. There’s people that will curl, they’ll curl one week, and they might not be there for two weeks. Because they’re on shift work, and they can’t come now. So a lot of the teams now, instead of four players, they have five players. So the two guys can switch off, one’s working, and the other one can play.

SJ:           Now, you have a small group belonging to your lodge right now, so what are the age ranges, currently? The average age.

BB:         I’m sixty-eight, so…

AM:       Yeah, I think everyone’s also sixty-five.

SJ:           That’s just the way it is. What do you like most about your organization?

BB:         Well, when we were having regular meetings and stuff, it was good. There was meetings, and then was whatever other fundraising activities we had to do, or work at, or help with stuff. And it was a social outing sort of thing.

AM:       And Brian, and some others, they did bingo every week.

BB:         Yeah, bingo Monday night. We used to have Monday night bingo.

SJ:           No, I didn’t know that.

AM:       At the old Elks hall, which is the Métis Center. Because after the one burned, near the hotel, then they built that one, so they ran bingo every night. And I guess-

SJ:           So you ran it every night? Not once a week?

BB:         Once a week. Yeah, Monday night.

AM:       But that hall would be packed.

SJ:           Now is that used to fund some of your fundraising activities, the proceeds from that?

AM:       Yeah.

SJ:           Oh wow, that would’ve been great.

BB:         All of our donations came out of what we raised at bingo, or any other fundraising activities.

SJ:           Now, for these bingos, did you always have enough volunteers to run it?

BB:         Most of the time, yeah.

SJ:           Okay, that’s good.

AM:       Because the Royal Purple also helped, the ladies’ side of it. Which doesn’t exist here anymore, because they infolded. But they would sell, you know, sandwiches and-

BB:         The canteen and the-

AM:       The canteen.

BB:         And a couple of them helped with some of the bingo cards.

SJ:           So, at the time you were running those bingo fundraisers, did you have the kitchen set up there?

BB:         Yeah.

AM:       And then the casino came.

[All laughing.]

SJ:           Really?

AM:       And that killed bingo, because there used to be bingo seven nights a week, in The Pas. You know, the Legion had their night-

SJ:           Yeah, but I thought theirs was Wednesday night.

AM:       And the Knights of Columbus had their night, so seven nights a week, there was bingo. Oh yeah, those hurt.

[clicking]

SJ:           We’ll continue with the interview.

BB:         For bingo, for all the service clubs, it was quite, there was, four nights, five nights a week, plus Friendship Centre used to have a bingo on Sundays. But, like Alfred said, then came the casino-

SJ:           Well, when did the casino arrive here? Was it here in 2000? Or 2001?

BB:         Something like that.

SJ:           Alright.

AM:       Because, they ran bingo too. Remember in that part of the Otineka Mall, that’s called the [What sounds like Roller] North?

BB:         Yeah, that was the other thing. OCN built their own hall, and started their own bingos, and they ran five nights a week, and then we started losing-

AM:       Losing numbers.

BB:         Instead of two hundred or some people, we were down to a hundred or some people.

SJ:           Yeah, that’s quite a drop.

BB:         And a hundred people would break even, providing you didn’t give any of the big pots away. We had one, the last game of the night was five thousand dollars, if you bingo’d on fifty-one numbers or less. Which didn’t happen often, but… But still, when it did happen, you….

SJ:           There it goes.

AM:       There goes the money.

SJ:           Now, what do you like the most about the Elks?

AM:       Well, I think it’s working with other members, and helping the community, and to participate in projects, and seeing things happen, like we give money to the Simonhouse Bible Camp, and just say, “take this money, and send some kids to camp.” ‘Cause otherwise, they wouldn’t go to camp in the summer. So that’s one way we help children, is by providing access. But it’s a good feeling, and also, some of their members, they write thank-you letters, and all that, those kinds of things.

SJ:           That’s nice.

BB:         We also gave money to the Scouts and to the Girl Guides. I forget how many years ago, but the Scouts went to the Maritime Provinces, and the Girl Guides went to Ottawa, and helped boost their fundraising. Yeah so it was, and we got recognized for it, with thank-you cards and whatnot.

SJ:           Now, do you have a story you can share that has to do with the Elks?

AM:       It’s all secret. We were sworn to secrecy.

SJ:           Oh geez.

BB:         I don’t know, the only thing is, like, some of the trips for spring district meetings, where eight, ten went in one bus. Yeah, it was exciting, and whatnot.

AM:       I think it’s just the socialization, like you would see people on a regular basis, like tell stories.

SJ:           So with the bus trip, what type of bus did you take, a regular school bus, or something more comfortable?

BB:         The air cadets bus, which would’ve been a retired school bus sort of thing.

AM:       Which we probably helped buy.

BB:         Yes, we payed for it. Anyways, yeah.

SJ:           Now, how would you personally describe the Elks?

BB:         Heh. I don’t really know. I don’t know how to describe it.

SJ:           What about you, Alfred?

AM:       Then, as things changed, people just kind of come in their regular clothes now. And I think that’s one of the big changes in a lot of service clubs.

BB:         Yeah, they’re doing away with regalia or fancy dressing stuff.

SJ:           Now, where would you get your clothing, and your accessories?

BB:         From the Grand Lodge, in Regina.

SJ:           Okay. So that’s where you get your merchandise.

BB:         They had a…I don’t know what they had. I guess they had a tailor, or whatever, or someplace, that made the blue blazers or-

SJ:           So it was blue blazers? Was it a white shirt and black trousers, or…

BB:         White trousers, and the blue blazers, and then the purple- Actually the blazers were more purple.

AM:       Yeah.

BB:         More like [what sounds like postcards].

[crackling]

SJ:           He’s showing me some badges of the-The Pas Elks, so one of them’s white, and sort of a dark purple. And the other one has a black shirt on, third purple, and some some gold embroidery.

BB:         These are all black and white.

AM:       Well that’s the purple one.

SJ:           Alright, and Alfred is showing me the cover of the book of history of the Elks of Canada, seventy-five years, 1912 to 1987. So you joined towards the end of that run, eighty-seven, eighty-eight.

AM:       And actually, a member from The Pas started the fund for children.

BB:         Right.

SJ:           Really?

BB:         Yes.

AM:       Like, nationally.

SJ:           Yeah, who was that person, can you remember?

AM:       I know it’s written in there.

BB:         What’s his first name? It was Wadelius.

SJ:           Was it Eric Wadelius?

AM:       Yeah, it’s Eric Wadelius.

BB:         Yeah, Eric Wadelius. He’s the one that proposed the fund for children idea to Grand Lodge, and it was approved, and then of course, they tried to steal it.

AM:       But it was Eric’s.

BB:         But he was recognized for it as being founder.

SJ:           Now, how was he related to Vaughn Wadelius? Was he his brother, or his uncle, or his father?

AM:       It was his dad.

SJ:           It was his dad, okay.

AM:       ‘Cause Olive was, who just died. Olive was Eric’s grave. So that was Vaughn’s dad. And I think they had what, three boys, or so, and maybe a daughter or two.

BB:         I’m not sure.

SJ:           Wow, that is pretty impressive. Now, that’s certainly up there in what I think would be one of your group’s greatest accomplishments, but can you think of any other great accomplishments that you guys have done, that you haven’t already mentioned?

BB:         Not really, no. Other than… No. I don’t think so.

AM:       But I guess the nice thing that shows that someone from a small community like The Pas has an idea, and it can be recognized and established nationally. You know, like helping kids. So that’s…

SJ:           That’s pretty cool, yeah. Now, the final question I have here, is “Do you think your time within the Elks has been well spent?”.

BB:         I think so. Hopefully, they can, some day, somewhere, will remember that we did make a difference to something in this town.

SJ:           Well, I hope so too, because we’re trying to do this with this online exhibit now. Now, do you have anything else you’d like to add, before we conclude the interview?

BB:         Well, I’ve some, a little bit of history here. The lodge, itself was started in October of 1926. And our original hall was lost on January 1^st 1987, and then the new building was built, and we did have a few members that made it all the way to the grand lodge. Adam Demnick was Grand Exalted Ruler of Canada from 1965 to 1966. I’ll leave the book with you, if you…

SJ:           So starting from page two twenty-nine?

BB:         Two twenty-nine.

[all laughing]

BB:         There’s not a lot in there, but it does give you that. And, apparently, in 1949, The Pas was chosen as count of the week, by [what sounds like oh-go-lee] Flour Mills, and we were given one hundred dollars for community involvement. So I don’t know, whatever else you can find in this, but there’s a little bit of something there.

SJ:           Thank you.

BB:         And there’s a CD there. I don’t remember, I listened to it, but I don’t remember what’s on it now. But it’s information about the elks.

SJ:           Okay. Great. So these will just be on loan for the purpose of developing the exhibit, and I’ll get them back to you pretty-

BB:         You can keep them if you would like. If you would like to keep the book and put it in your…

SJ:           Okay, we will conclude this interview now. Thanks for coming, gentlemen.

BB:         You’re welcome.

[End]